DECEMBER 17, 2009




BOARD MEMBERS PRESENT:   Roxanne Pecora, Chairperson

                                                            Charles Wesley

                                                            Fred Zimmer



                                                            William Devine

                                                            Michael Minor


BOARD MEMBER ABSENT:        Dennis Suraci


ALSO PRESENT:                             Myles Putman, M.L. Putman Consulting


Chairperson Pecora called the meeting of the Town of Esopus Planning Board to order at 7:00 p.m. beginning with the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.  Roxanne then advised the public of the building’s fire exits and roll call was taken.


Chairperson Pecora explained to those present that the Planning Board will be unable to hold the Public Hearings scheduled for this evening due to the fact that we do not have a quorum.  At the time the meeting was scheduled and up until today, we had planned to have a quorum.  Therefore, there can be no formal legal decisions made and there will be no Public Hearings in a formal sense.  They will all be rescheduled for next month at the same time they were scheduled for this month.  However, since they were scheduled and the public is present we are going to call them public information sessions.  We will take comments and they will be available in the record for the next formal meeting in January.




Clough Harbour & Assoc. (Esopus Lake a.k.a. Hudson Point)…………….$1,017.25

Clough Harbour & Assoc. (Aleo)………………………………………..…$   547.50

Daily Freeman (Jubie P.H.)………………………………………………...$     10.35

Daily Freeman (Aleo P.H.)…………………………………………………$     11.70

Daily Freeman (Giampetro P.H.)…………………………………………...$     11.25     

Planning Board P.H. Fee – Aleo…………………………………………....$   200.00

April Oneto (Secretarial Services)…………………………………………49 ½ hours


Vouchers were read into the record and signed by Chairperson without a Motion to approve due to end-of-the-year business. 




GRAY:  2009-17 -  Minor Subdivision – 1863 Broadway 9US Route 9W; State Hwy

                5508), West Park; SBL: 80.001-4-4.2


Chairperson Pecora asked if there was anyone present who wishes to comment on this application.  No one present wished to comment on this application.


GIAMPETRO:  Case #2009-10 & 2009-22 – Subdivision & Conditional Use Permit -

                             444 New Salem Road; SBL: 56.019-2-30.1


Chairperson Pecora sked if there was anyone present who wished to comment on this application. 


Shannon Goodrich - 470 New Salem Road – Asked if the intention of the applicant was to split that property in two.  Fred stated that they are splitting it basically at the driveway that goes up into the property.


Charles Cole – 430 New Salem Road – Mr. Cole asked if there are any plans for buildings on this.  Fred stated that there is no new construction is anticipated. 


Chairperson Pecora recused herself from this application.  Vice Chairmain Fred Zimmer took over as Chairperson for this application.


ALEO:  2008-13 & 2008-14 – Lot Line Adjustment & Conditional Use Permit –

               210 – 218 Hasbrouck Avenue, Port Ewen; SBL: 56.059-4-5


Vice Chairperson Zimmer asked if there was anyone present who wished to comment on this application. 


James Smith was present on behalf of property owner Maria Vivianni.  Mr. Smith stated that their biggest concern is the water problem.  He stated that he did see some of the blueprints and they received a letter stating that it is going to be a two-family duplex house but from what he has seen from the blueprints it looks like four families with the garages underneath.  Fred stated that he does not know where he saw that but this application is before the board for a duplex.  Mr. Robert Carpenter was present representing Mr. Aleo.  He stated that he has prints showing what the house will be. 


Anthony Urban – 187 Hasbrouk Avenue – He was questioning what the proposal is.  Mr. Urban was shown a copy of the map.  Fred stated that there are two proposals in front of this Board.  There is a lot line adjustment to combine three lots into one lot and the other is a conditional use permit to construct a two family dwelling.  Mr. Urban questioned if the area was zoned for that use.  Myles stated that this is a residential zone and a two family dwelling can be constructed with conditional use permit.  Mr. Urban questioned if this hearing was going to be held next month and if it will be the same sort of meeting.  Fred stated that it would be the actual Public Hearing.  Why is the property not being developed as a one family like the rest of the neighborhood?  When the handicapped accessible apartments went, in there were a lot of questions about developing the rest of the property in a similar manner and it was stated at that time it could not be some sort of a way that the rest of the area could be further developed.  Fred asked him to be a little clearer.  He stated that it is all one family homes.  Fred stated that the zoning permits two family with a Conditional Use Permit.  This is a permitted use.  Mr. Urban stated that Spring Street is just a paper street. 


Fred stated that Mr. Aleo has done a drainage study on a pre and post condition with the placement of this house on that property.  With what is being proposed there should be actually less run-off than what is happening now on that property.  It will not be a very insignificant amount but it does show up as slightly less. The Conditional Use Permit is for a two-family duplex dwelling.


Fred turned the meeting back over to Roxanne.




GRAY:  2009-17 -  Minor Subdivision – 1863 Broadway 9US Route 9W; State Hwy

                5508), West Park; SBL: 80.001-4-4.2


Robert Gray and Camilla Gray were present.  Robert stated that he is prepared to make a submission for the next meeting based on the November memo from M.L. Putman Consulting.  This submission addresses the comment about the front and rear portions of the lots to be combined and not considered as separate lots, the disturbance limit and he thinks he has addressed most of the comments.  Next month he hopes to see even less conditions.  Applicant submitted 10 prints and a summary letter of changes.  Roxanne asked if they have heard anything from CSX.  Robert stated that they have not heard anything.  The agreement will be between the property owner and CSX.


GIAMPETRO:  Case #2009-10 & 2009-22 – Subdivision & Conditional Use Permit -

                             444 New Salem Road; SBL: 56.019-2-30.1


Barbara Giampetro was present.  Barbara stated that she called Chris Kresser from the Department of Health who stated that the septics are fine but requested that she hire an engineer to see that if the septics fail there is a place to put in another septic and also that another well is not necessary.  She will need to place on the plan where another well can be located.  She got in touch with an engineer who happens to be related to the surveyor.  Barbara was told that the Board will need something in writing from the Board of Health regarding the septic and wells and she will need to submit new prints showing the location of the reserve area.  Public Hearing will be rescheduled for next month.


ALEO:  2008-13 & 2008-14 – Lot Line Adjustment & Conditional Use Permit –

               210 – 218 Hasbrouck Avenue, Port Ewen; SBL: 56.059-4-5


Roxanne recused herself from this application and Fred Zimmer took over. 


Stacia and Steven Hudler requested to speak on behalf of this application.  They are concerned about Spring Street.  Fred suggested that they go to the Town to request to buy Spring Street since it has never been developed as a road.  They were directed to approach the Town Board. 


Fred stated that Mr. Aleo will be combining three lots into one and construct a two family dwelling on the combined lot.  The lot line adjustment will need to be approved first in order to approve the Conditional Use Permit for a two family dwelling.  It was recommended that the engineer and the surveyor get together and make sure that the drawings are in agreement with each other.  Applicant will need to get something in writing from the Highway Superintendent for the driveway access and he will need to get something in writing from Don Kiernan, Water & Sewer Superintendent for the water/sewer connection.  The newest drawings and the drainage study needs to be turned in.  We will need a deed with the easement in it.  In the draft easement, it states drainage lines and we would like to have it changed to drainage structure.


The Public Hearing for Aleo will be rescheduled for January 28, 2010 meeting.


Roxanne returned to the Board at 7:55 PM.




ZABIK:  Case #2009-25 – Lot Line Adjustment – 25 & 29 Flatsview Court,

                 Ulster Park; SBL: 64.001-2-23 & 24


Alex Zabik present.  Myles reviewed M.L. Putman Consulting Report dated 12/10/09, copy given to applicant and copy placed in file. 


The applicant is proposing a lot line adjustment which will reduce the area of an existing grandfathered undersize lot and this can not happen without a variance from the Zoning Board of Appeals.  Applicant has been instructed to speak with the Building Inspector for a referral to the ZBA.  When applicant is done with the ZBA process he will need to return to the Planning Board for the lot line adjustment.



                        Sketch Plan – 185 Broadway (US Route 9W; St. Hwy 310) Kline Lane,

                        Port Ewen; SBL: 56.060-3-28.1


Chairperson Pecora stated that there was a potential for a conflict on this application since she is President of the Town of Esopus Library Board and Michael Minor who is also on the Planning Board is Treasurer of the Town of Esopus Library Board.  Following a lengthy discussion with the Planning Board attorney, attorney for the Mid-Hudson Valley Federal Credit Union and the Credit Union as to whether or not there is a conflict.  This issue has been resolved and it has been agreed that there is no conflict.  Michael Moriello, attorney for the Credit Union stated that he agrees that there is no conflict and would like this on record.  Roxanne stated that the former Library located at 189 Broadway, Port Ewen, New York is also in Contract of Sale with the Credit Union which should be noted in the record.  Roxanne stated that there is no monetary gain for her or Michael Minor.  Michael Minor will need to make a personal determination as to how he would like to deal with this application. There is a letter from the Planning Board  Attorney and if anyone wishes to look at the letter it will be part of the record. 


Myles reviewed M.L. Putman Consulting Report dated 12/11/09, copy was given to applicant and copy was placed in the file.  Michael Moriello, Esq., and Bruce Utter, Praetorious and Conrad were present representing the applicants for this project.


Mike Moriello stated that they sent a letter to the DEC and Natural Heritage to ask if there were any streams, water bodies, water courses or sensitive resources, endangered species.  He has received a response from DEC that none are listed.  He would like to enter this into the record. 


They were contacted by Rob Liebowitz of the Ulster County Planning Board and asked that they have a Gateway Meeting in the beginning of the project.  Mike told him that it did not make sense to do this before the beginning of January so that they could get a feeling from this Planning Board.  He will be getting in touch with them to schedule this meeting and he thinks there may be someone from DOT at this meeting.  Roxanne asked Mike to let her know when this meeting is scheduled because she would like to be there and she would like Myles to be there.  She expressed her wishes that there be no meeting with the County without some representation from this Board.  Roxanne stated that the County knows that this is the way it is supposed to be done.  Roxanne stated that any meeting that any applicant has with the Ulster County Planning Board; that Board is to notify the local Planning Board so they can make arrangements to have someone attend from their board if they so choose.


Mike stated that they did have a meeting with Mr. Corrigan from NYSDOT and Bruce and a representative from Mid-Hudson Federal Credit Union.  Mr. Utter stated that they submitted the plans that the Board has this evening to Mr. Corrigan and they had an informal review at the residence in Poughkeepsie.  The plans will call for turns to the right out of the site, no left hand turns.  Fred stated that there will need to be signs there.  They agreed to this.  At this point conceptually where the curb cuts are shown, is where they will be. 


Mike stated that while they were at the site they did take a look at the back of the site specifically with reference to stormwater.  Bruce stated that they are planning on zero net increase of stormwater from the site.  They will be doing borings out there.  Bruce stated that they will probably end up doing some type of detention to slow the water down and release it at predevelopment rates.  There will be under an acre of disturbance and no water quality requirements.  They realize with the soils out there erosion is a concern and they will have a full erosion and sediment control plan.  Bruce stated that he does not know at this point if they will go underground because underground will be more of an infiltration thing.  They may treat a pocket and then release it.  Most likely they will probably bring it out to Kline Lane because there is a paved swail along Kline Lane that goes down to the culvert.  Roxanne stated that all of the drainage to Route 9W converges in back of the Pharmacy to Kline Lane and years ago the Highway Superintendent put a pipe there but there is no easement.  If we get the developer to the Tucker Pond project to finish this project, we will get there.  At this time, the Town does not have any way to maintain it.   Fred stated that they may be further ahead with underground before they are done.  They can look at it the other way but the soils are so erosive to put any type of detention pond, he does not know if it is going to stay there.  Roxanne thought it may be able to be piped out to East Main Street.  Fred stated that it is quite a distance and it has no place to go.  Roxanne stated that it could go down to Tilden on the other side and go out.  Fred stated that there are no pipes up the hill.  They all go down through backyards.  Discussion regarding this issue continued.  Roxanne will ask Alan Larkin, Highway Superintendent, about this.  Mike asked when the original drainage pipes were put in and if it was over 10 years.  Roxanne and Fred both stated that it was over 10 years ago or longer. 


Mr. Utter stated that as far as this site is concerned stormwater has always run that way and as long as we match pre-development conditions and don’t make it worse they are okay. 


Mike stated that the last issue after traffic is the Freeman house itself.  He has contacted Joseph Diamond, Ph.D., New Paltz, to conduct a Phase I.A Literature Search on the house.  He has not done his tests as yet but he has gone all the way to Phase 1.B.  The last information that they have is that the house is not listed on the National Register of Historic Sites and not listed on the State Register of Historic Sites and the question as to whether it is eligible to be listed is still up in the air.  He is taking a look at that.  The applicant notes that the property owner has never offered it for listing to their knowledge.  Mr. Diamond will give them an idea of what the Historic Preservations ideas on the house are.  It is a fairly old house that is in very, very poor condition but it is something that they have to deal with.  Any time you are thrown into a State discretionary permit you have to deal with SHPO under the Historic Preservation Act even though it is a Type II Action because it is less than 4,000 sq. ft. gross square footage.  Mike stated that the irony is that if they were not looking for a permit from DOT the building could be taken down with a demolition permit.


Mike stated that at this time they do not have any representatives from Mid-Hudson Federal Credit Union here tonight. 


Charlie pointed out that on the map it lists the library as being owned by Freeman and this is a mistake that will be corrected.  Charlie asked if there is any plan for the bank to buy the library and make it part of this plan.  Roxanne stated that the Library is in contract with the Credit Union.  Mike stated that right now if they did a lot line revision to add the library portion it would be subject to SEQR.  If they need this for stormwater, they may have to change this application.  They have not gotten far enough with the plan to know how much land they are going to need at this point.  Mike stated that they qualify for the redevelopment portion of the SPEDES Permit.  What is impervious now they do not have to account for.  What they make impervious they have to account for. 

Bruce stated that basically they don’t even need a GPO8 Permit because they are under an acre of disturbance.  Fred stated that they are under an MS4 which brings everything back to the Town.  The Town is the controlling factor which would mean that they need an MS4 sign-off on the Erosion Plan and the Drainage Calculation Plan but they do not need to file a Notice of Intent Form.  He will check on this.   


Fred stated that he thought it was very nice for them to put in the plan that they would use some of the stone from the Freeman Building for the fasade on the new building.  Mike stated that this was the architect who has been out to the site.  Fred mentioned the contours shown on the grading plan.  Bruce stated that the contours are the existing contours they just wanted to show what the existing site is right now.  They will be changing that to show some type of grade. 


Fred questioned if SHPO comes back and tells them that they have to keep the building.  Suppose Mr. Freeman decides that he wants to knock the building down that would go away then.  Mike stated that this would be his understanding. 


Roxanne stated that she is glad to see that they have worked something out with the Pharmacy.  There is some parking.  Bruce stated that originally there were four spaces and they were able to increase it to 8.  Roxanne stated that it would be nice if they could designate one or two for handicapped parking.  Roxanne stated that a pharmacy is under legal constraints because of narcotics so there can only be one entrance into a pharmacy and they lost their parking in the front with the Route 9W reconstruction. 


Fred stated when they are back with DOT they will have to lengthen the light when you come out from Kline Lane.  Fred stated that you only get about two cars out at this time.  Bruce stated that it is his understanding that Kline Lane is only one way but it is two way below the entrance shown.  It is really a one way but it is used differently. 


Myles questioned if they have any statements from the project architect about the integrity of the building and if it is suitable for reuse.  He is sure that this question will come up as well as the question about reuse building of the former Bank of America.  He is sure that this will come up at a public hearing.  Fred stated that there was some talk about using the library as a temporary facility.  This came up in pre-submission.  Roxanne asked if they knew anything about doing anything temporarily as they talked about in pre-submission.  Mike does not know anything about this. 


Mike stated that as far as the alternative site, Myles is 100% right.  We do not control the sites that an applicant uses.  We can not be forced to look at alternative sites. 


Meeting ended at 8:35 PM.




NEXT MONTHLY MEETING:       January 28, 2010


DEADLINE DATE:                          January 14, 2010


NEXT PRE-SUBMISSION:             January 5, 2010


Respectfully submitted:



April Oneto    

Planning Board Secretary